PSA: Online Sports Betting Is Considered A Cash Advance

Just a quick PSA, courtesy of our friends over at r/churning:

Online sports betting transactions with sites like FanDuel are typically considered a cash advance with most (all?) credit card issuers, such as Chase, Amex, Barclay, etc. This is especially relevant now that online sports betting is becoming legal in more states, having recently become legal in New York.

Apparently, fantasy leagues are typically not considered a cash advance, per this Yahoo article, but betting on a particular game is considered a cash advance.

Update: Also read through the comments as it appears there are some sites and some cards and some types of bets that do count as an ordinary purchase.
    Chuck
  • On January 20, 2022, 12:00
Tags: cash advance

View Comments (36)

  • Okay fine, I'll give up my GOAT: yahoo daily fantasy. $1,000 credit card deposit limit per 30 days. After that, you can get approved for $2,000/day deposits. No credit card processing fee. Withdraw to PayPal tax free (wait for all deposits to post before withdrawing).

    Posts as digital games. Muwhahahaha

  • There is a little more risk with sports books, but if arbed correctly, this is right up most of the heavy churners alleys and likely more profitable- at least at the signup.

    Pairs nice to go to the different states and utilize the cc Pts too. Follow the Reddit Sportsbook thread. Similar to churning on Reddit.

    I find myself putting credit cards 💳 n the back burner messing with Sportsbook as it is more profitable for me right now.

    • Thank you, @guest_1319054! Feel free to link to as many of my comments as possible!

  • I've deposited tens of thousands of dollars on various daily fantasy sports betting sites across various cards, and never once been charged a cash advance fee.

  • Only losers pay CA? Don't pending transactions get reversed for winners? I'm more interested in those so called free play/risk free SUB offers. When will we see that post?

    • You fund the account and then use the funds in the account to make the bets - at least on every site I've ever used - the bets are not charged/charged back directly to the card.

      It makes sense that it would be a CA because otherwise, you could fund the account with a credit card and then withdraw all the money through a different method such as check, and essentially get a free CA.

    • Can be profitable if one can understand the real value of the bonuses/free bets.

      'Risk Free' is basically a marketing lie though.

      Most (not all) sites give you a 'free bet' if you lose your first bet. If that free bet is $500, it's only worth about half of that since the free bet will statistically hit about 50% of the time as the oddsmakers are generally good at setting the spreads bet. Bet at -110 odds and the return is $227.

      So upon a loss of that $500 initial 'risk free' bet, one gets something worth about $227, so they've lost $273. Hardly risk free. But certainly reduced risk... Expected return is a net positive so with many bets, it can be fruitful.

      I'd suggest just making a separate bank account for online dealings. The sites usually will only send money to a bank account you have deposited from.

      • You can bet the other side at a different sportsbook, and lock in a profit of about ~80%. You're losing EV, but eliminating variance.

        I've made an obscene amount of money churning free bets, SUBs, and promotions, and haven't done an ounce of "gambling" in the process.

        • How does that work lol you need to literally a) find the arbitrage b) execute quickly c) bet different notional amount d) bet large notional amount to be worthwhile

          Take a site giving A > B at +200, so profit $100 if A wins assuming you bet $50, to hedge on the other side, you bet B>A at -100, so you would need to bet $200 on the other site to be broke even

          What is the guaranteed strategy profit here? You can't be shorting your bet lol. You are simply offsetting your wins/losses, but there is still risk,

          It is similar to saying Big Mac costs more in rich areas than poor areas, but no easy way to arbitrage here

          • I'm not referring to arbitrage at all, I'm only referring to promotions. A very common type is: "Bet this spread up to $50, and if you win, you get a freebet equal to your wager."

            With the expectation that you can convert that freebet at an 80% value (which is usually the going rate), you hedge on another book. $50 on Book A, and $70 on Book B. If the latter wins you lock in a $20 profit. If the former wins, you've paid $20 for a $50 free bet, which you then convert into a $40 win using the similar hedging process, for a $20 net profit.

          • Well yeah but how do you make lots of money on this strategy, usually these promos come with bonus limits

          • Most of these promos have a guaranteed EV of $15-25, but occasionally they're as high as $100-150. Caesars will occasionally run 50% profit boosts with a $200 limit, and they're eminently exploitable. Then keeping in mind the fact that there are 5-10 sportsbooks doing promos like this in most jurisdictions, and it's not at all difficult to make a few hundred a week.

      • Depends, caesar was offering 100% risk free bets matching to $3000, that was stupid. People can just use the 1st $3000 on something, say -100, if you win, great you make $3000, if you lose, another $3000 risk free bet. Now if you are risk averse, bet on something sure, warriors over pistons and wait till the last possible moment end of Q3 to bet, you get -10000 odds but now you have $3000 in cash and can be withdrawn.

        It's basically a free call option

  • huh, the one time i did it (BetDSI) Hilton Amex went thru no problem. IIRC, tho, Chase didn't even go thru. coded as "fraud"

  • In Michigan, I have found that Discover still codes as a purchase for any site that accepts it (often need to sign up for their Play+ account)

  • I use Paypal for FanDuel and DraftKings sportsbook and have never encountered a cash advance fee.

    • Is 'sportsbooks' similar to fantasy, mentioned in the post, or something else? Sorry, I'm not very familiar with betting!

      • It's been my experience that users on the sites operating both a sportsbook and fantasy sports site (e.g., FanDuel, DraftKings) share a "common fund" through both interfaces (so it wouldn't really matter which one you deposited money into).

        I've been using my Chase Freedom Unlimited via PayPal for as long as I can remember to fund my sportsbook and fantasy account. I do it solely to collect Chase UR. It's only a matter of time before it's a cash advance across the board. Honestly, I'm surprised it's taken this long.

      • Sportsbooks are run by the casinos such at BetMGM, Caesars, and other online betting platforms. Draftkings and Fanduel are kind of confusing because they offer fantasy sports, but also offer sportsbetting on a linked site that is separate from the original.

        Fantasy was legal before sportsbetting because it was deemed a 'game of skill' due to loophole in some online legislation that put an end to legal online poker back in the day. Although online sportsbetting has been around for a while they were based on offshore sites that didn't operate in the U.S. - it has just recently became legal in multiple states because the government gets to take their cut, so the casinos are raking it in now! So they are technically different games, but the same risking money to win money. Fantasy is contest based vs. other fantasy players...sportsbooks are you against the house. They both charge a rake or vig on paid contests or bets.

    • Late to the party, but can you then use PayPal to deposit money into FanDuel and then withdraw it without making a bet (or similar) and score the points?

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