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alex
alex (@guest_1607962)
April 28, 2023 15:15

0.9% has been announced as the fixed rate for a total of 4.3%. https://www.treasurydirect.gov/savings-bonds/i-bonds/i-bonds-interest-rates/

Jahn Anders
Jahn Anders (@guest_1607417)
April 27, 2023 18:39

This three month interest penalty is wrong. One only loses 2 months of interest if one buys at the end of the month (and who would buy on 4/1 vs 4/30 when all purchases in April reflect the 4/1 date. So holding for 14 months (April 30, 2023 – Jul1, 2024) gives the full 12 month rate.

Nick
Nick (@guest_1606183)
April 25, 2023 20:06

This new variable rate means the average combined rate for a newly issued I-bond purchased before the end of the month will be an average of 6.893% and 3.807%, or 5.35% for the first year only if held beyond 5 years. Although I think inflation will come down in the next few years, making a longer hold a poor choice. If redeemed at one year, losing the last three months of the 3.807% combined rate, these I-bonds would yield 4.43%. Not as terrible as I had imagined due to that MoM 0.5% print a few months ago, but still not enough yield to beat other available options.

If you are thinking of doing a 15 month hold, the yield would be reduced to 4.28%. Don’t be tricked by the initial 6 months of 6.893%. Think of the minimum holding term of 12 months, the 5 year minimum holding term to avoid losing the last three months of interest, and softening future inflation expectations. The only reason I can think of to buy these bonds is to make a bet on an unlikely ramp up in inflation in the next 6 months to a year.

arihalli
arihalli (@guest_1606261)
April 25, 2023 22:20

Nick, its possible, the Fed will begin to drop rates precipitously, or slowly. Because of the damage that the rate hikes have done. If they shoot liquidity into the system, which i think is likely, won’t inflation regenerate?

Nick
Nick (@guest_1608723)
April 30, 2023 07:43

arihalli I do think there is some stickiness to our current inflation, especially in some of the core elements. So if even more excess liquidity is injected, that could signal an inflection point is near.

Right now, the Fed is still hiking, and saying they plan to hold rates higher for longer. I tend to agree with you that at some point in the future they will need to drop rates, but at what point do they start? They could choose to start rate cuts right away or pause and hold rates constant for a period of time, then start rate cuts. Based on what they are doing and still saying, I think the latter is more likely at this point.

Either way, I think the new purchase with the higher 0.9% fixed component could be more valuable for any longer term outlook like this, since it will benefit more from any future upswing in inflation from those liquidity injections.

arihallli
arihallli (@guest_1608754)
April 30, 2023 09:52

Hi Nick, thanks for the response, and agree with all you say.
1) its a dilemma. I think that IBonds are a good long term choice, as i believe inflation will increase, over time. And the .9 rate is sweet.

2) although, it appears, that the Fed wants to be steadfast in licking inflation —— Congressionals, only get re-elected when their constituency is pleased. And i am thinking, that once the adverse effects of the interest rate rise do occur, after going thru the system, a lot of people will be very unhappy. My guess, is pressure will make the Fed reverse. And that will boost inflation again. And they have no one to blame but themselves, for instituting Zirp for so long. That is my 2cents

mangorunner
mangorunner (@guest_1608791)
April 30, 2023 11:19

It’s fun to watch interest-rate speculation by using the CME FedWatch Tool:
https://www.cmegroup.com/markets/interest-rates/cme-fedwatch-tool.html

Jahn Anders
Jahn Anders (@guest_1607416)
April 27, 2023 18:39

This three month interest penalty is wrong. One only loses 2 months of interest if one buys at the end of the month (and who would buy on 4/1 vs 4/30 when all purchases in April reflect the 4/1 date. So holding for 14 months (April 30, 2023 – Jul1, 2024) gives the full 12 month rate.

Nick
Nick (@guest_1608725)
April 30, 2023 07:52

Jahn Anders Hey Jahn, great point, I forgot the entire interest for the first month is added to the bond even though you’ve only held it for a few days at that point. So it’s actually 4.59% rate, not terrible, but this rate still isn’t competitive compared to other available options due to the restricted liquidity.

Ice
Ice (@guest_1605939)
April 25, 2023 13:53

Rate Change Deadline: To receive the current 6.89% rate for I Bonds in TreasuryDirect, you must complete your purchase by 11:59 p.m. Eastern Time on Thursday, April 27. Learn More.

Eric
Eric (@guest_1606105)
April 25, 2023 17:51

Where are you seeing that? Do they clarify what “complete your purchase” means?

Do we need to simply initiate the purchase on TD’s site by that time or do the funds need to get there by then (meaning we would need to initiate the purchase tomorrow)?

jd
jd (@guest_1606114)
April 25, 2023 18:02

its on the front page. just need to initiate it by that time

KyleC
KyleC (@guest_1603151)
April 21, 2023 01:16

If I don’t plan on holding the I-bond for 5 years, is there any reason I should buy I-bond in April vs. a 12-month CD with a rate at 5+%?

jd
jd (@guest_1603274)
April 21, 2023 08:12

depends on your marginal state tax rate
buying 4/27/23 and redeeming 4/1/24 gives about 4.75% divided by (100 – your state tax %), which for me would push it up to the equivalent of an 11 month CD at 5.15%

KyleC
KyleC (@guest_1603801)
April 22, 2023 00:52
  jd

Thank you!

Rob
Rob (@guest_1598609)
April 15, 2023 17:32

My simple brain still doesnt comprehend how the ones we bought in 01-01-22 are worth more then the ones we bought in 10-01-21. Looking at the chart it seems I should also cash out the newer ones out 1st too. Its been a fun strange ride.

jd
jd (@guest_1598762)
April 16, 2023 01:09

yeah, it seems paradoxical, but the older bonds spent 6 months earning only 3.5% whereas the newer ones started at 7.1%.

James
James (@guest_1598549)
April 15, 2023 15:27

Just want to add another perspective I don’t see mentioned much. Comping to treasures bills is sort assuming you redeem early. Nothing wrong with that. Another way to look at these is to compare them to tips particularly if you plan on holding longer term. 30 yr tips have a real yield of about 1.4% now, so for 100 bps sacrifice in yield you get the put (redemption) and tax deferral which are both very valuable. The put seems pretty great to me in this rate volatility. There is a ton of real interest rate risk in a 30 yr. Though if you think rates are going back down you might want that duration and prefer the tips. On tax deferral, you get total control of when to recognize the income. You can choose to redeem in a lower income year. There are certainly some other differences but over a longer term period many are less impactful.

mangorunner
mangorunner (@guest_1598481)
April 15, 2023 12:42

You get full interest for the month you invest, but no interest for the month you redeem.

Interest earned each month is posted on the first day of the following month. Interest earned in April 2023 will be posted to your I-Bond account on May 1, 2023.

So buy late in a month; redeem early in a month.

Alex
Alex (@guest_1598773)
April 16, 2023 01:52

So, if you buy at the end of a month and redeem on the first of a month, you basically get almost 1 month of extra interest. That would effectively reduce the 3 months of no interest to 2 months. Am I right?

That means, if you buy at the end of April and redeem on 7/1/2024 you hold the bonds for little over 14 months and get 6.89% for 6 months (Apr-Sep), around 4% for another 6 months (Oct-Mar), and 0% for 3 months (Apr-Jun), which equals to ((6.89/2 + 4/2)/14)*12 = 4.67% annual rate. Any flaws in my calculations?

rick b
rick b (@guest_1598878)
April 16, 2023 09:41

Correct, you should redeem on the 1st or 2nd day of the 3rd month after it switches to low rate. You’ll pay 3-mo of lower rate penalty, but only have money tied up for 2.04 months, and have a chance to get a full month of higher rates elsewhere.

dsn
dsn (@guest_1598921)
April 16, 2023 11:36

Based on your comment, Alex should redeem on 6/1/2024, not 7/1/2024, right?

Alex
Alex (@guest_1599167)
April 16, 2023 22:11

Actually, here is an improvement to my calculations. You don’t have to hold it for little over 14 months, you can hold it for little over 11 months. So, if you buy at the end of April and redeem on 4/1/2024, then you get 6.89% for 6 months (Apr-Sep), around 4% for 3 months (Oct-Dec), and 0% for another 3 months (Jan-Mar), and your annual rate will be ((6.89/2 + 4/4)/11)*12 = 4.85%.

Ben
Ben (@guest_1601463)
April 19, 2023 08:50

I believe you have to hold it for at least 1 year, though I’m not sure if the holding time is counted in the same way.

https://www.treasurydirect.gov/savings-bonds/cashing-a-bond/

jd
jd (@guest_1601512)
April 19, 2023 09:51

all bonds have the 1st of the month as the issue date so 4/1/24 would be the first day it could be redeemed

Steve
Steve (@guest_1601050)
April 18, 2023 21:35

If I sell on May 1st, do I get April interest? or should I sell on May 2nd so the interest posts on the 1st?

jd
jd (@guest_1601514)
April 19, 2023 09:53

the current value should update on the 1st with the previous month’s interest

Esquiar
Esquiar (@guest_1598467)
April 15, 2023 12:18

1 year treasury bill is better guaranteed yield than buying an I bond and redeeming after 12 months due to the 3 month interest penalty

B
B (@guest_1598456)
April 15, 2023 12:01

Hi

I read through this, but I want to make sure my math is correct

I bought
Oct 1st, 2021 – now earning 6.48% – i should sell Jan 2024 (because Oct 1st is the rate reset)
Jan 1st, 2022 – now earning 6.48% – i should sell Oct 2023 (because Jul 1st is the rate reset)
Jan 1st, 2023 – now earning 6.89% – i should sell Oct 2023 (because Jul 1st is the rate reset)

am I correct?

Celia
Celia (@guest_1598477)
April 15, 2023 12:34
  B

This was posted earlier by Gadget - Bank Bonus Geek 🔗 , gives the best timeline.

https://tipswatch.com/2023/03/29/want-to-exit-your-i-bond-investment-youd-better-have-a-plan/

But the last one on your list, purchased 1/1/23 won’t be eligible for redemption until 1/1/24.

Mikey
Mikey (@guest_1598534)
April 15, 2023 14:40
  B

B, I laughed when reading your comment because there are LOTS of us out here who made similar purchases during the exact same timeframe and are now beginning to consider the best time to sell. Speaking only for myself I never intended to hold these ibonds for even 5 years, much less 30. The upcoming (roughly) 4% rate may not be all that painful since we’ll all eventually incur a 3 month penalty. Therefore, I’m more interested in the NEXT updated Ibond rate (meaning the one in November). At that point we’ll have a better idea of what opportunities the then current competing rates provide. And whatever the choice it’s clear that the first day of the month is the time to cash in.